Thursday, 2015-08-06

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GitHub174[wunderboss] tobias pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/vOQOb15:51
GitHub174wunderboss/master 44666b5 Toby Crawley: Don't use the built-in idle timeout for websockets...15:51
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jbossbotTitle: Don't use the built-in idle timeout for websockets · projectodd/wunderboss@44666b5 · GitHub15:51
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jcrossley3tcrawley: why too wide?15:57
tcrawleywhat makes it so wide, or why is 5+ seconds too wide of a timeout?15:57
jcrossley3yes15:57
tcrawley1) dunno, b) expectations - if I set a timeout of 100ms, I want a timeout reasonably close to that, not 50 times that15:58
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jcrossley3is this only a problem in EAP?15:59
tcrawleyit's more egregious in EAP, but I've seen timeouts of around a second (when set to 100 ms) in undertow16:00
jcrossley3how is the reaper thread shutdown?16:01
tcrawleyI considered using the reaper for ws just for EAP, but that meant probably yet another subclass, etc16:01
projectodd-ciProject wunderboss-incremental build #269: SUCCESS in 9 min 42 sec: https://projectodd.ci.cloudbees.com/job/wunderboss-incremental/269/16:02
tcrawleyit runs until it is interrupted16:02
projectodd-ciToby Crawley: Don't use the built-in idle timeout for websockets16:02
jcrossley3that is a historically bad platform-dependent strategy16:02
tcrawleywhich means we may need to interrupt it on undeploy16:02
tcrawleywhat is?16:02
jcrossley3why not set running to false instead?16:02
jcrossley3relying on thread interruption16:02
tcrawleyhow is that platform dependent?16:03
jcrossley3because threads are16:03
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jcrossley3this is java 10116:03
jcrossley3the complexity of adding a reaper thread is easy to underestimate16:04
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jcrossley3and won't the reaper be subject to the same potential delays?16:21
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GitHub129[wunderboss] tobias pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/vOQPW16:44
GitHub129wunderboss/master a44799b Toby Crawley: Add first-class shutdown actions.16:44
GitHub129wunderboss/master 42be74b Toby Crawley: Actually stop the reaper thread when wboss is stopped16:44
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jbossbotTitle: Comparing 44666b50a8e4...42be74b0b634 · projectodd/wunderboss · GitHub16:44
tcrawleyjcrossley3: the issue was I wasn't initiating a wboss triggered shutdown at all, so the thread would continue to run in-container16:45
tcrawleyand I agree that the reaper is easy to underestimate, but I don't have a better solution16:45
tcrawleythe reaper will have delays, but on the order of ns to ms, not s16:45
tcrawleyif it has seconds of delay, then everything would have seconds of delay, and you've got bigger problems than late timeouts16:46
jcrossley3not dependent on the thread scheduler or the callbacks that thread is invoking?16:46
tcrawleysure, it's dependent on those things, but if the thread scheduler backs you up that much, something else is badly wrong.16:48
tcrawleyI suppose a user could back things up by doing something blocking in the close callback16:48
tcrawleyhow would you avoid these issues?16:49
jcrossley3i'm just not sure we can guarantee a QoS any more than what our underlying components can.16:51
jcrossley3so i'm not convinced the tradeoff of the reaper thread is worth it. to me, if the thing ultimately times out, we've achieved the goal16:53
tcrawleybut we can provide a better baseline that EAP - it's consistently 1+ second16:53
tcrawleybut how would you timeout streams then?16:53
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jcrossley3with that global setting16:53
jcrossley3s/global/server/?16:53
tcrawleyI'm not opposed to going back to the built-in facilities for a websocket, but if we expose a per-ws timeout, I'd like to expose a per-stream one as well16:54
jcrossley3is that a reasonable enhancement to undertow itself?16:55
tcrawleymaybe? but it's not exposed via the servlet api, so we couldn't use it in WF, and wouldn't exist in EAP16:55
projectodd-ciProject wunderboss-incremental build #270: SUCCESS in 9 min 2 sec: https://projectodd.ci.cloudbees.com/job/wunderboss-incremental/270/16:56
projectodd-ci* Toby Crawley: Add first-class shutdown actions.16:56
projectodd-ci* Toby Crawley: Actually stop the reaper thread when wboss is stopped16:56
jcrossley3my overall feeling is that it's an extreme edge case feature. is that wrong?16:57
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tcrawleyI would say it's edge case, but not extreme. anyone using sente will leak connections if they don't ping every user at an interval of < 25s16:58
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tcrawleybut you could argue that sente should close all channels it opens on the server side, instead of relying on the web server to do that16:59
jcrossley3and i think the built-in facilities would also address that particular case, right?16:59
jcrossley3so the per-stream TO is extreme?17:00
jcrossley3maybe pedantic or consistent is a better word17:00
jcrossley3if so, then to me the reaper thread is too high a price for that feature. i'm just expressing my opinions. you're closer to the issue than me. follow your heart.17:02
tcrawleyI guess w/o a stream timeout, sente would have to clearly document that you need to set a global timeout in Immutant17:04
tcrawleywith links to docs that we provide stating how, and why17:04
jcrossley3and fwiw, i *would* argue that anything that opens a resource is responsible for closing it17:04
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jcrossley3otherwise, reaper threads17:06
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tcrawleywhich users may have to implement themselves if they want to close the resources that they open17:08
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tcrawleyhmm, so for an AsyncContext, the timeout isn't an idle timeout, but a total timeout. which I didn't want to use because it didn't mirror the idle-timeout of a ws. but it still may be worth exposing, and would be just as useful here, I think17:14
tcrawleyassuming we can provide the same functionality in undertow17:15
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jcrossley3i created a class called KeyWrapper that I pronounce how Jackie Gleason might pronounce "crapper"17:29
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tcrawleyyou should have called it "Krapper"17:37
jcrossley3pb17:39
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tcrawleyjcrossley3: how do you feel about "You can also specify an `:timeout` option, that will cause a Websocket to be closed if *idle* more than the timeout, or an HTTP stream to be closed if *open* more than the timeout. It defaults to 0 (no timeout), and is in milliseconds."18:25
jcrossley3other than s/an/a/ seems fine18:25
tcrawleya, I renamed it from :idle-timeout.18:26
tcrawleys/a/ah/18:26
tcrawleywe can do that w/o a reaper thread18:26
jcrossley3in light of that, now i notice the distinction you're making between idle and open18:27
jcrossley3it should probably be more explicit18:27
tcrawley"You can also specify a `:timeout` option, that will cause a Websocket to be closed if **idle** more than the timeout, or an HTTP stream to be closed if **open** more than the timeout. It defaults to 0 (no timeout), and is in milliseconds."18:28
jcrossley3something along the lines of "This means an HTTP stream will be closed after :timeout elapses, regardless of activity."18:29
jcrossley3maybe s/activity/idlility/?18:29
jcrossley3idolatry?18:29
jcrossley3idleness?18:30
tcrawleyhow's about: "This means that once opened, an HTTP stream will be closed after :timeout elapses, regardless of activity."18:31
jcrossley3i like it18:32
tcrawleynow to figure out why it 500's in WF :)18:32
tcrawleywith no stack18:32
jcrossley3i have all the support-caching-in-eap code i wanted to write in place18:33
jcrossley3but it doesn't work :(18:33
tcrawleyyay!18:33
tcrawleyboo!18:33
tcrawleywanna pair on it?18:33
jcrossley3you'll just laugh at my java debugging skills :)18:33
* tcrawley promises to keep his laugher shut18:34
jcrossley3lemme try a few things first18:35
tcrawleykk18:35
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jcrossley3tcrawley: i found the problem18:56
jcrossley3need to think about the solution18:56
tcrawleykk!19:00
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jcrossley3omfg19:54
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tcrawleyjcrossley3: sup?19:57
jcrossley3it's just a lot more work than i expected19:57
tcrawleylife can be that way19:58
jcrossley3thanks norman vincent peale19:58
tcrawleyis he related to johnny mercer?19:58
jcrossley3tcrawley: no20:00
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GitHub116[wunderboss] tobias pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/vO5V120:13
GitHub116wunderboss/master 8de3c16 Toby Crawley: Use underlying mechanisms for any channel timeout [IMMUTANT-523]...20:13
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jbossbotTitle: Use underlying mechanisms for any channel timeout [IMMUTANT-523] · projectodd/wunderboss@8de3c16 · GitHub20:13
jbossbotjira [IMMUTANT-523] support idle timeouts for asnyc channels [Open (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, Unassigned] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/IMMUTANT-52320:13
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tcrawleyjcrossley3: thanks for pushing back on the reaper - I like ^ much better20:18
jcrossley3tcrawley: thanks for taking my feedback constructively :)20:18
tcrawleyI value your opinion & experience20:19
tcrawley(and no, I'm not saying you're old)20:19
tcrawley:)20:19
jcrossley3hahaha20:19
* jcrossley3 was just typing that!20:19
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projectodd-ciProject wunderboss-incremental build #271: SUCCESS in 6 min 12 sec: https://projectodd.ci.cloudbees.com/job/wunderboss-incremental/271/20:22
projectodd-ciToby Crawley: Use underlying mechanisms for any channel timeout [IMMUTANT-523]20:22
jbossbotjira [IMMUTANT-523] support timeouts for asnyc channels [Open (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, Unassigned] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/IMMUTANT-52320:22
jbossbotgit [immutant] push master 9b649e3.. Toby Crawley Use newer gniazdo, patched to set cookies on upgrade20:24
jbossbotgit [immutant] push master 06b1472.. Toby Crawley Use newer wunderboss timeout functionality [IMMUTANT-523]...20:24
jbossbotgit [immutant] push master URL: http://github.com/immutant/immutant/compare/3a1ca9f...06b147220:24
jbossbotjira [IMMUTANT-523] support timeouts for asnyc channels [Open (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, Unassigned] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/IMMUTANT-52320:24
jcrossley3tcrawley: so the new gniazdo worked? we can get rid of the other hacked one?20:24
tcrawleywe still use the async http tool for http stuff, but we don't need it for websocket tests anymore20:25
jcrossley3cool20:25
tcrawleyand we're now using a hacked gniazdo, so, 6 of one, a dozen of another20:25
jcrossley3you hacked it? nice :)20:25
tcrawleyyeah, it doesn't support setting cookies20:26
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jcrossley3(my wife says that, btw)20:26
tcrawleyshe's a good woman, despite what bobmcw says20:26
jcrossley3bobmcw: has no idea she even exists20:26
tcrawleyhe's not a very good manager then20:27
jcrossley3he'd be the first to confess that20:27
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projectodd-ciProject immutant2-incremental build #610: SUCCESS in 10 min: https://projectodd.ci.cloudbees.com/job/immutant2-incremental/610/20:38
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tcrawleyhey, non-cluster integs for EAP passed on CI! let's see if cluster works20:47
tcrawleybecause I've never even tried that locally :)20:48
projectodd-ciProject immutant2-incremental-integs build #98: STILL FAILING in 9 min 52 sec: https://projectodd.ci.cloudbees.com/job/immutant2-incremental-integs/98/20:48
projectodd-ci* Toby Crawley: Use newer gniazdo, patched to set cookies on upgrade20:48
projectodd-ci* Toby Crawley: Use newer wunderboss timeout functionality [IMMUTANT-523]20:48
jbossbotjira [IMMUTANT-523] support timeouts for asnyc channels [Open (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, Unassigned] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/IMMUTANT-52320:48
jcrossley3tcrawley: :)20:48
jcrossley3i'm down to three failing tests for caching in eap20:48
tcrawleyyay!20:49
jcrossley3i *think* they're due to ispan behavior changes20:49
jcrossley3e.g. how putAll behaves when some of the values are null20:49
projectodd-ciProject immutant2-incremental-integs-eap build #6: STILL FAILING in 8 min 26 sec: https://projectodd.ci.cloudbees.com/job/immutant2-incremental-integs-eap/6/20:50
projectodd-ci* Toby Crawley: Use newer gniazdo, patched to set cookies on upgrade20:50
projectodd-ci* Toby Crawley: Use newer wunderboss timeout functionality [IMMUTANT-523]20:50
jbossbotjira [IMMUTANT-523] support timeouts for asnyc channels [Open (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, Unassigned] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/IMMUTANT-52320:50
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jcrossley35 tosses, 7 ignores20:50
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tcrawleyI think the cluster tests on EAP have to wait until we have caching20:50
jcrossley3prolly, yeah20:51
tcrawleylooks like timeouts break WF8.2, for the same reason we can't do async sends there - we deadlock on the session cache20:54
tcrawleybut that's a problem for tomorrow!20:55
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